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Octane booster

5K views 43 replies 12 participants last post by  Magoodia 
#1 ·
This OK to throw in the tank stock?
 

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#2 ·
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#3 ·
#5 ·
dont waste your money. first and foremost, youre not getting 8-10 octane, youre getting octane points. as in, from 93 to 93.8 and thats if you use it with a single gallon of gas. thats why you see that it states "up to" 10 gallons of gas. it doesnt raise 10 gallons of gas 8-10 full octane points, it doesnt even raise 10 full gallons of 93 to 93.8-94. it raises 10 full gallons of gas to anything higher than 93, so 93.1 would still beenough to say "up to".

go to a paint store and ask for 100% pure toluene. its like 114 octane, (R+M)/2. toluene makes up around 30-50% of the gas you already put in your vehicle, it will not hurt anything. i have used it before.
 
#8 ·
You serious about the toluene?
 
#6 · (Edited)
Trust me I’ve been there done that and my spark plugs had turned into a bright orange red color. Now I know that shouldn’t happen at all but if my spark plugs changed color like that I wonder what happens to other components of the engine. I would say it felt like my performance was hindered due to the spark plugs and tip being covered in that orange red color. Also here is a post from another forum where a user used octane booster on his BMW and fouled the plugs, “
Octane Boost Fouling Plugs
Ok guys have you seen this, all of my spark plugs had this orange coating on them and they were causing the engine to misfire. They all had to be replaced, now I did put 104 octane racing fuel in my car once unleaded. And I have used octane boost, BMW said that it is from one or both of the 2 and that they would not replace the plugs again for free next time. They said that only BMW products can be put in the engine otherwise the plugs will foul. What do you think caused my plugs to foul, I only run 93 octane and I put in Octane boost every once in a while. Are there better plugs or is racing fuel bad. I am going to the strip tomorrow morning and was wondering if I should not use racing fuel”.

Here is another user from
that same forum leaving a comment on the dangers of octane boosters “
Its simple, unleaded race fuel is fine.
Octane booster with mmt WILL foul your plugs, its very bad....”
 
#7 ·
Well....f%%k me. $23 flushed.

I guess ill use it to start my fire pit a few times and then put the bottle on the shelf in the man cave. 🤷‍♂️

Thanks guys.
 
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#10 ·
Well....f%%k me. $23 flushed.

I guess ill use it to start my fire pit a few times and then put the bottle on the shelf in the man cave. 🤷‍♂️

Thanks guys.
where did you buy it from? You should still be able to return it if you tell them why you cant use it becuase it will foul the spark plugs and it contains MMT which can foul the o2 sensors and you dont wanna run the risk of damaging your car.
 
#16 ·
Rectangle Font Electric blue Service Signage

Literally Klean Strip Toluene. I understand what you're getting at so here's the pic.

While I'm at it, I was thorough enough to check the SDS to make sure its 100% toluene, and it is. 👍
 
#17 ·
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#18 ·
#19 ·
If anyone is familiar with IAM (ignition advance multiplier) in the subie world.

I had a custom tune done and my revision 7 was same as 6 only a little more ignition advance. Rev 6 IAM was pretty happy at 1, Rev 7 he tried to push timing further but my octane limits where tapped so IAM dropped and stayed below 0.7x sometimes as low as 0.5x. I decided to test out boostane. I used only 0.75oz per 1 gallon. IAM never dropped from 1 again. Retested without Boostane later to verify if it was a fluke or bad gas(which I have yet to experience) same results consistently repeated.

typically on a stock car/tune 93octane will be IAM 0.95-1, 92octane 0.85-.9, and 91 octane about 0.7-0.8, so roughly 1 octane per 0.1-0.15 IAM is pretty common.

based on that I would conclude 0.75oz per 1 gallon of gas resulted in at least a 2 octane increase. At least 2+ octane equivalent worth of added timing.

Boostane is supposedly formulated much better to mix with the gas and keep it in suspension preventing separation and settling of the additives like what happens with other products (according to them). I think this combined with how little needs to be mixed the effects on plugs and cats should be minimized.
 
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#22 ·
If anyone is familiar with IAM (ignition advance multiplier) in the subie world.

I had a custom tune done and my revision 7 was same as 6 only a little more ignition advance. Rev 6 IAM was pretty happy at 1, Rev 7 he tried to push timing further but my octane limits where tapped so IAM dropped and stayed below 0.7x sometimes as low as 0.5x. I decided to test out boostane. I used only 0.75oz per 1 gallon. IAM never dropped from 1 again. Retested without Boostane later to verify if it was a fluke or bad gas(which I have yet to experience) same results consistently repeated.

typically on a stock car/tune 93octane will be IAM 0.95-1, 92octane 0.85-.9, and 91 octane about 0.7-0.8, so roughly 1 octane per 0.1-0.15 IAM is pretty common.

based on that I would conclude 0.75oz per 1 gallon of gas resulted in at least a 2 octane increase. At least 2+ octane equivalent worth of added timing.

Boostane is supposedly formulated much better to mix with the gas and keep it in suspension preventing separation and settling of the additives like what happens with other products (according to them). I think this combined with how little needs to be mixed the effects on plugs and cats should be minimized.
Boostane probably contains 5-10% MMT according to its MSDS. Boostane claims they use proprietary carriers so the MMT won't settle out of solution but I fail to see how that prevents the combustion by-products of MMT (manganese oxides, mainly Mn3O4) from forming and coating sensors, plugs, and cats. I personally wouldn't use an octane booster that contains MMT. Infiniti specifically states not to use MMT in their vehicles.
 
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#20 · (Edited)
i dont have a calc handy so doing it the hard way, using actual math, is to multiply base fuel gallons (BG) times it's octane (O), multiply toluene gallons (TG) times it's octane (O), sum the results then divide that by the total number of gallons of base fuel and toluene (G) used to get effective octane (EF). this should be accurate to one full octane point.

(BG*O)+(TG*O)/G=EF
nine gallons of 93 and one gallon of toluene:
9*93 = 837
1*114 = 114
837 + 114 = 951
951/10=95.1

the following results are for 10 gallons total, with 93 octane as the base fuel:
9:1 ratio: 95.1
8:2 ratio: 97.2
7:3 ratio: 99.3
6.5:3.5 ratio: 100.35
6:4 ratio: 101.4
5:5 ratio: 103.5

if you live in a state that hates fun, here are the ratios for 91 octane:
9:1 ratio: 93.3
8:2 ratio: 95.6
7:3 ratio: 97.9
6:4 ratio: 100.2
5:5 ratio: 102.5

ive not exceeded 100 octane as i was using it in a n/a 4 banger with 11:1 CR but i do know for sure that as you get closer to 50/50 ratio or above, the engine tends to run worse at idle. at higher concentrations, toluene doesnt like to do stuff until its warm because of its density. the F1 teams had to run their 86% toluene mix (~1:7 ratio using the formula above) through heat exchangers with engine coolant to heat it up enough to burn correctly. the reason for 86% was due to the rules at the time, limiting them to something like 102 octane, ive forgotten specifics.

additionally, as you increase the percentage of toluene, you start experiencing similar issues as ethanol with rubber hoses and seals. since gasoline can be something like 45% aromatics and still be considered gasoline, i would imagine that anything below a 50/50 mix wont be an issue. last time i checked, most gasolines are like 10-35% toluene roughly. if you used a 50/50 mix, id add in a little marvel oil, mineral oil, or even trans fluid, with the 10 gallon mix if you really wanted to be safe. again, i used toluene (and xylene) in amounts up to 100 octane with no problems at all across two different 4 bangers with no issues. i never bothered to add additional lubricant.

finally, the real comparison for toluene vs ethanol is the ron, mon, and aki. toluene is 121 RON, 107 MON, 114 AKI. AKI is the (R+M)/2 rating you see on pumps. E85 is 105 RON, 86 MON, and 95 AKI. at first glance, it looks like E85 isnt as "good" as a toluene blend but the effective AKI of ethanol is higher than 95 because of the latent heat of evaporation. its acts more like its 105 AKI. e85 will have lower EGTs and defintely lower intake temps on port injection or carbed engines. it still helps on DI engines but the effect isnt nearly as pronounced as there isnt as much time for the E85 to absorb heat. a pitfall of pump gas E85 is that its not consistently E85, especially during the winter. it can drop as low as E50(!) and still be classed as E85. now you have to lug around a stupid testing kit and stand at the pumps like a weirdo with beakers and test tubes n crap if youre tuned on the razor's edge of E85. tuning to E30-50 blends have become more popular because of this.
 
#30 · (Edited)
here's a thread with probably what everyone wants to see, engine internals after using MMT. even though this is a modern hemi head and top end, the results will be the same as all engines work the same way.

of particular note is the build up on the exhaust valves. i think were all aware of build up on plugs and sensors, most ppl dont care that much because theyre relatively easy to swap. the cats can be a concern but i dunno if ive ever seen anyone post a pic of a plugged cat in correlation with octane boosters. but now, what i have just seen is direct proof of build up on exhaust valves and seats, detrimental enough that valve sealing was likely compromised.

starts at post 238. if page 12 doesnt load, look on page 12 of that thread.

i just want to add that octane boosters cost equal to or more than toluene. currently, toluene is 4x less expensive than boostane by weight, contains zero magnesium or anything else, and is a component of gasoline already. if you are willing to use an octane booster, then you should be willing to use toluene instead.

also, i have personal experience with it and also xylene. plugs were clean and the car ran fine. best side effect was that the exhaust smelled cool too, lol.
 
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#31 ·
here's a thread with probably what everyone wants to see, engine internals after using MMT. even though this is a modern hemi head and top end, the results will be the same as all engines work the same way.

of particular note is the build up on the exhaust valves. i think were all aware of build up on plugs and sensors, most ppl dont care that much because theyre relatively easy to swap. the cats can be a concern but i dunno if ive ever seen anyone post a pic of a plugged cat in correlation with octane boosters. but now, what i have just seen is direct proof of build up on exhaust valves and seats, detrimental enough that valve sealing was likely compromised.

starts at post 238. if page 12 doesnt load, look on page 12 of that thread.

i just want to add that octane boosters cost equal to or more than toluene. currently, toluene is 4x less expensive than boostane by weight, contains zero magnesium or anything else, and is a component of gasoline already. if you are willing to use an octane booster, then you should be willing to use toluene instead.

also, i have personal experience with it and also xylene. plugs were clean and the car ran fine. best side effect was that the exhaust smelled cool too, lol.
Lot of people throughout that thread ran boostane with no issues, the one who claimed issues where running a very large amount.

post 238 he is running 32oz of octanium per 15gallon for 10k miles with seemingly no issues, even inspecting plugs/02s. It wasn’t till engine tear down he noticed build up on valves. However hellcats are PI not DI so at least for this platform that portion would probably not be a concern.

also that is still a lot of fuel additives per gallon. and also a different product to boostane (even if both have MMT)

I think we are all aware the risk of MMT, the question is how much % of MMT per gallon of gas and at what rate till potential issues. Does delivery method and the products ability to keep it in suspension and thoroughly mixed evenly throughout the fuel reduce any of the potential risk and/or rate of build up.
 
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#34 ·
We can debate this until the cows come home but the bottom line is if there is a safer, less costly octane booster like toluene available, why use a metal-based one that can foul engine components?

I have no need for an octane booster, but if my build required additional octane to avoid pre-detonation, I know which one I would use. Besides, not everyone is aware of the detrimental effects of MMT and knowing both sides of the issue can help them make a responsible choice. That's why I bring it up.
 
#38 · (Edited)
We can debate this until the cows come home but the bottom line is if there is a safer, less costly octane booster like toluene available, why use a metal-based one that can foul engine components?
Safer?
until this question is answered we’ll have to agree to disagree
“and again these studies you speak of. What percentage of total fueling was MMT? What was the totaling amount of fueling used?(IE 1,000cc injectors at 80% duty or 500cc at 30% etc… would impact how much MMT at any one instance contacted anything) What other additives where involed or not involed in the testing? At what rate/timeline did the failure occur? What failed? What was the consequences of the failure? 50% shortened life expectancy from plugs/sensors? 90%? 10%?”

Cheaper?
klean strip toluene is about 4-5x the cost to gain the same octane rating compared to boostane.
 
#35 ·
Just to keep the thread moving along - E85 is much cheaper than Premium fuel, Boostane, and/or Toluene and typically I don’t use gloves at the gas pump. 😉
 
#36 ·
E85 much cheaper? Factor in the cost of all the hardware you installed to run E85.
 
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#37 ·
Ah shucks - busted
 
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#39 ·
in the link i provided, the guy used 32oz for 15 gallons of gas, that equates to ~2oz/gal. if he was using 93, if would get him to around 102-3 octane. that mixture is WELL within the recommended guidelines. hell, even if it were mixed with e85 (as i suspect from the past directly after), the mixture used shouldnt matter. to get to 116 octane, boostane recommends 32oz per gallon of gas. thats 16x the amount that the guy in the post used. i can only imagine what an engine would look like using that. the build up on the face of the valves and seats is undeniable (literally, theres pictures) in his engine. the valves werent even fully sealing any longer.

it seems neither of us is going to budge on this. im not denying its effectiveness, im not even saying the deposits on the plugs or o2 sensor even bother me. i do think there are issues with cats in the long term and having seen the valves on that engine only further solidifies to me that burning magnesium as an octane booster isnt a good idea.
 
#40 ·
in the link i provided, the guy used 32oz for 15 gallons of gas, that equates to ~2oz/gal. if he was using 93, if would get him to around 102-3 octane. that mixture is WELL within the recommended guidelines. hell, even if it were mixed with e85 (as i suspect from the past directly after), the mixture used shouldnt matter. to get to 116 octane, boostane recommends 32oz per gallon of gas. thats 16x the amount that the guy in the post used. i can only imagine what an engine would look like using that. the build up on the face of the valves and seats is undeniable (literally, theres pictures) in his engine. the valves werent even fully sealing any longer.

it seems neither of us is going to budge on this. im not denying its effectiveness, im not even saying the deposits on the plugs or o2 sensor even bother me. i do think there are issues with cats in the long term and having seen the valves on that engine only further solidifies to me that burning magnesium as an octane booster isnt a good idea.
Do you not think the build up on the valves would be much more of an issue for Port injection (his) vs direct injection (OP’s/VR30s)
Also again maybe it’s marketing hype but boostane claims to have solved the issue of maintaining perfect mixture and suspension in the fuel which seems to likely be at least a contributing factor to the MMT build
up which is further amplified by running greater and greater mixtures (2oz/gallon)

Who ever said to use 32oz of boostane?
I said quite the opposite in my posts, no?

1 octane bump typically allows enough added boost/timing to be had to net about 1.5-2% more power. A simple 3 octane increase could easily net close to an additional 25-30whp on a VR30 with proper tuning or roughly equal to ldp+cbe in terms of overall gains. According to boostane mixing charts approx 0.62oz of boostane premium (lower strength than professional) per gallon of gas should net a 3 octane increase. That would be 12.4oz per 20gallons.

Now I do think WMI and/or E85 are much better solution than these “bandaid” boosters. But I do think in moderation, boostane specifically can be used to net some solid benefits/gains for very cheap, easy, and done fairly safely.

That could be having 2 maps 1 for boostane and one without and only use kill mode/boostane on special occasions. Or if you want full tilt 24/7 running boostane all the time, expect to have plugs/02s be on a more frequent change interval maybe 50% life expectancy. But they are easy to change and relatively cheap considering. For people who drive only say 3-5k miles a year that is still not that frequent in terms of overall time/years.

Cats might be my biggest concern agreed (still maybe less with boostane though), But I’m more of a dog person than a cat person myself. ;)
 
#42 ·
I seem to have opened a can of worms. Lots of good information though...trying to soak it all up.

Thanks for taking the time to respond. 🤙
 
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